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Re: 'synaptic' removed from buster




On Sat 06 Apr 2019 at 09:26:51 (-0400), Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Friday 05 April 2019 23:06:13 David Wright wrote:
> > On Fri 05 Apr 2019 at 14:21:21 (-0400), Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > On Friday 05 April 2019 11:05:00 Jonathan Dowland wrote:
> > >
> > > [...]
> > >
> > > > Indeed, and running the UI toolkit code as root was always
> > > > considered a bad design pattern, even whilst it works under X.
> > >
> > > But thats no longer possible with X, root cannot use the users
> > > display.
> > >
> > > And for me, the only user on this multiple machine network, that is
> > > a major PITA because of the extremely inconsistent workaround's.
> > >
> > > Give us a method to su or sudo root, and run the stuff needing root,
> > > at least a consistent procedure thats good for all releases.
> > > Changing it around makes applying the same user package update to
> > > every machine a different operation. LinuxCNC is updated in master
> > > at least 2x a week sometimes daily as a new feature gets added and
> > > needs debugged. So even if wheezy is dead, synaptic gets run quite
> > > frequently to keep that up to date. The jessie install on the pi for
> > > instance won't let me run synaptic from anyplace but its own
> > > keyboard. Anyplace else, and ssh'd in, I have to sudo apt etc.
> > >
> > > Consistency is the magic word, and we don't have it.
> >
> > I don't understand how you can expect consistency in an OS that
> > supports ~10 architectures and four releases, written over a period
> > of, say, six years or more. Particularly considering that it's
> > not possible to revise the earlier releases to take account of
> > changes forced by the evolution of software external to the project
> > and by increasing security exigencies.
> >
> If I'm willing to forgo web browsing, wheezy can still be running 20 
> years from  now, the only changes needed would be for ssh|l|tls stuff if 
> you are using it for email. I am behind a dd-wrt flashed router with no 
> local firewalls running anyplace on this local net.
> 
> No one has come past that that I didn't invite in, and I'm not doing a 
> thing to get that security that the rest of you can't do, probably even 
> better.
> 
> So I don't worry about security, I worry about interoperability on my 
> local network, but the way thats headed, there will not be the 
> possibility of my ssh'ing into one of my other machines and doing a 
> simple ls or pwd to see where I am.  That IMO is not real security, but 
> PARANOIA and should rightly be called as such.
> 
> This os was originally able to ignore whether the key/mouse stroke came 
> from its own keyboard, or one in Lisbon, Portugal. Or from this machine, 
> 100+ feet of cat5 away. This is NOT an M$ single user system, so quit 
> trying to restrict it to what a winders box can do.

I keep reading here that you have problems with ssh -X and -Y, but
find it difficult to replicate them here. I've been running a mix of
wheezy/jessie/stretch here with no problems (though I have retired
the wheezy versions recently and removed all references in
apt-cacher-ng now that the archives have moved).

> > You can hide any differences in how you obtain root by just wrapping
> > your command in a script, appropriate for each architecture/release.
> > Just one script to maintain if you use case or if/else.
> 
> Then Make it so...

I meant for you to do that, in the same way that I write scripts for
some user programs in order to cover up the differences between
versions of Debian, or the hardware (like sound cards) on different
hosts. It just means the differences are put into the scripts so you
can type the same thing without having to remember all the time.

$HOSTNAME is obvious, but I also have $Mycodename which is set from
the first line of sources.list. This gives a more consistent answer
the debian_version, os-release etc as it's under my control.

Cheers,
David.