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Re: Debian Buster release to partially drop non-systemd support




KatolaZ - 16.10.18, 13:39:
> On Tue, Oct 16, 2018 at 12:38:19PM +0200, Michael Biebl wrote:
> 
> [cut]
> 
> > What you say is obviously wrong, and you should know that if you
> > follow devuan.
> > 
> > Even the founder of Devuan regularly uses exactly the words Ansgar
> > described.
> > Chris Lamb not to long ago was target of those conspiracy theories
> > and hate mails (search for redis on their mailing list) if you
> > don't believe me.
> The problem that spurred this thread is that sysvinit needs a
> maintainer. That's why some of us are here: our intention is to help
> with maintaining sysvinit in Debian if possible, since we will keep
> maintaining it in Devuan nevertheless. You can still decide you don't
> want this kind of help because we stink or you find Devuan "toxic"
> (even if this would be against some of the principles we should
> instead agree upon). That could be fine, if motivated by a solid
> reasoning, and not just by a flame.
> 
> In the last four years there has been hatred from both camps (Debian
> vs Devuan), and there is no doubt that most of that could/should have
> been avoided on both parts. Grepping through email archives and
> resurecting posts from 3 or 4 years ago won't help to move on, though.
> 
> I am not interested in chit-chat or flames, because those don't get
> packages released. The only reason I am here is that sysvinit is
> effectively getting kicked off Debian, and I think I can help avoiding
> that.

I wholeheartedly agree with that.

Digging for mud in the past just brings up mud from the past as I wrote 
in my other post.

As we are all human beings with feelings, human beings who sometimes 
feel hurt and or hurt each other, there is plenty of opportunity to find 
mud in the past. And I am pretty sure that you can find this mud on any 
side, with any party of the discussion back then.

I won't engage in doing so anymore than I did in my other post as it 
does not help to move forward and get work done.

I strongly recommend to move on and see whether KatolaZ and others from 
the Devuan can help with maintaining sysvinit. I see this decision 
mainly with those who maintained it in the past.

Michael, I interacted both with you and with KatolaZ. I have seen you at 
Debconf 2015 and I was surprised to see how friendly you interacted with 
others. I surprised cause I still remembered how I interacted with mail 
– and I am including myself in here, I think I did not make it easy for 
you at times. I also interacted with KatolaZ and he treated me friendly 
and kindly as well.

I perceived both you, Michael, and you, KatolaZ as being friendly in 
supportive. Each one of you in their own ways.

Michael, now can you let go and let the shadows of the past… be in the 
past? Having sysvinit be maintained in Debian again, can also help you 
along with not having to upload it yourself from time to time anymore :)

Of course, as long as KatolaZ or other Devuan developers helping with 
Sysvinit maintenance are not at least Debian maintainers someone would 
need to sponsor their work. But it could be Ian or any of the former 
Sysvinit maintainers as well. And it may be a good approach to start 
cooperation in this smaller way.

Thanks,
-- 
Martin