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Bug#886238: Build-Profiles purpose, mechanism vs policy (was Re: Bug#886238: Please introduce official nosystemd build profile)

On Tue, Jan 09, 2018 at 01:23:32PM +0100, Guillem Jover wrote:
> On Mon, 2018-01-08 at 18:37:11 +0000, Wookey wrote:
> > On 2018-01-03 13:30 +0000, Simon McVittie wrote:
> > > On Wed, 03 Jan 2018 at 15:12:51 +0300, Hleb Valoshka wrote:
> > > > Please introduce official nosystemd build profile so downstream
> > > > distributions can send patches to package maintainers with
> > > > systemd-less build instead of keep them in home.

> > > In general, build profiles are not meant
> > > to result in functional changes to packages
> > > (<https://wiki.debian.org/BuildProfileSpec#Profile_built_binary_packages>),

> > This is correct for the mechanism's main/original purpose of
> > bootstrapping/removing cyclic dependencies.  The idea is that you
> > can't change functionality and still use a dependency with the same
> > name, if you actually want to automate the bootstrap process (because
> > you don't know which features of a package the depending-on package
> > uses).

> Exactly, pretty much because otherwise doing automatic bootstrapping
> (reusing existing package names and dependency relationships) becomes
> either very hard or impossible to handle or reason about.

So, the folks who are working on bootstrappability have made their decision
about the semantics of these profiles, and those that do the work get to
decide, and all that.  But I don't agree that there's anything difficult to
reason about here.

The sole requirement that a stage1 package *must* fulfill is that it's
usable for bootstrapping any stage2 packages that require this package (or,
if no such stage2 packages exist, then "final" packages).  The requirement
that this be done in such a way that the list of files within the stage1
package is no different than the list of files within a final package is an
additional, artificial constraint.  I don't believe it fundamentally makes
the bootstrapping problem any easier than if this were done ad-hoc.

Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer                                    http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@xxxxxxxxxx                                     vorlon@xxxxxxxxxx

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