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Re: Debian Stretch new user report (vs Linux Mint)

On 01.12.2017 16:53, Ian Jackson wrote:
> Simon McVittie writes ("Re: Debian Stretch new user report (vs Linux Mint)"):
>> I find it interesting that we're having this conversation at the same
>> time as a thread about how there should be a configuration option that
>> denies our users the opportunity to choose to install non-free software.
> Perhaps you mean: a configuration option that allows a user not to be
> nagged to install non-free software.
> FAOD I agree that the current situation with install images for random
> PCs is quite unsatisfactory, but I don't know how to square the circle.
> Ian.
Ian, thats dead easy - put the needed packages onto the iso and be done
with. The installer should have an option to opt-in contrib and/or
non-free. Done. Ok, that was the technical part. The other part of the
story would be that the FSF wouldn't like us for that step. Anyways,
they don't recommend Debian because debian make it still to easy for
users to install non-free stuff, so i think this would be no real
probelm. Bradley M. would be upset too - and some other people who think
that every debian user need to be educated that one has to buy hardware
that would work without non-free things. The majority of the users would
be happy. Hmm, but there would be still the catch 22 with the social
contract and the free software guidelines. What do we weight more: Happy
users or free software? The FSF has answered this before - Debian is not
free, so they don't recommend us. Their choice. We choose to promote and
deliver iso's without any non-free. Our choice. And for the people with
the needed knowledge there are iso's that will work well with nearly all
hardware. Sounds fair, doesn't it?

The result will be: Normal users will use fedora, ubuntu etc - these
distributions that are proven to work otb with the most hardware in the
wild and are recommended by their friends who tested them before. Debian
will be limited to users who prefer free software or have the knowledge
to work around these limitations. Or are able to find the working isos
with non-free. To me it not sound like the best service for our users
_and_ free software. Free software is a learning process and my guess is
that this process will not start for a lot of people if they can't
install a working Debian firsthand. It might be that i see this to

My 2¢