Re: Bits from the 10th Debian Groupware Meeting
- Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2017 17:44:37 +0200
- From: Martin Steigerwald <martin@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Subject: Re: Bits from the 10th Debian Groupware Meeting
Christian Seiler - 03.08.17, 17:34:
> On 08/03/2017 03:21 PM, Rainer Dorsch wrote:
> > thank you for all the links. My main question was why it is not listed at
> > all in the groupware wiki, you could easily list nextcloud/owncloud in
> > the section "Groupware projects not currently considered for inclusion in
> > Debian".
> It's a wiki, feel free to add it. :)
> > For the technical part, I am wondering if that is still a real issue. I
> > see
> > the latest version 12.0.0 was released at May 22 2017, since then there
> > was
> > not even a bugfix release.
> In terms of Debian release cycles that is still a very short time.
> And the main issue here wasn't the release frequency; the main issues
> - most importantly: how to support updates from Debian release X to
> X + 1, and upstream didn't want to support that at all, because the
> amount of minor versions between two Debian releases was too much
Yes. You nicely summarized it. Seafile for example has from/to versioned update
scripts. And an update between several releases is easy: You just run all the
update scripts in between. Owncloud didn´t provide for this and David Prévot
back then put a lot of work around it, only to be accused of irresponsible by
> My primary impression is that there's a mindset gap here: what I
> really like about Debian stable - especially for servers - is that
> the software included doesn't change except for security updates
> and other serious bugs. Especially if I administer something, and
> that something is not the primary thing I'm interested in in my
> daily life, then I really want to be able to basically install and
> forget the whole thing. And Debian provides me with that opportunity.
> And Debian provides the opportunity that when I upgrade Debian once
> every two or three years I can migrate my installation and only
> have to test invasive changes _once_ at that point.
Yes, and thats a principal mind gap between many web application developers
I concur with your preference here. I don´t want to upgrade to major new
software versions all three month. Thus I plan to install Seafile instead, but
AFAIK there are only Seafile client packages ready for Debian. I´d love to see
official Debian packages for the server component, but currently see myself
putting time into this.
> > 2) If Nexcloud is interested to bring their software into the debian repo,
> > they can help run their regression tests on the upgrade path implemented
> > for Debian stable releases (which happens infrequently)
> Well, sure, if they were interested in supporting these kinds
> of upgrade paths, which they strongly implied that they are
Fairly enough this was with Owncloud upstream… and more than a year ago. I
believe many Owncloud developers moved on to Nextcloud… so I belief Nextcloud
upstream consists of mostly the same people… I never really confirmed that
belief, beyond anecdotical statements I read in several blog posts.